AA didn't work for Debra Oberlin....apparently
Former president of MADD arrested on DUI charge
Published: Thursday, February 24, 2011 at 11:58 a.m.
Last Modified: Thursday, February 24, 2011 at 11:58 a.m.
Last Modified: Thursday, February 24, 2011 at 11:58 a.m.
A former president of the defunct local chapter of Mothers Against Drunk Driving was arrested recently by the Gainesville Police Department on a DUI charge.
Debra Oberlin, 48, was arrested after she had difficulty on a field sobriety test. She registered a .234 and .239 on breath alcohol tests. Florida's legal limit for driving is .08.
Oberlin, a Realtor, had no comment when contacted Thursday by The Sun.
On Feb. 18 at 1:10 a.m., an officer spotted Oberlin driving erratically on Northwest 19th Street, swerving and crossing lanes, an arrest report states. Oberlin was pulled over in the 3600 block of Northwest 39th Avenue.
The officer wrote that Oberlin smelled of alcohol and had watery, bloodshot and dilated eyes. The report states that Oberlin told the officer she had four beers.
Gainesville's MADD chapter existed for several years in the 1990s before closing in 1996 because of lack of financial support. Oberlin was the chapter president for three years.
Disclose.tv - Former President Of MADD Arrested On DUI Charge Video
Blogger Jeremy Witteveen (Le Café Witteveen) posted a blog entry entitled "I love you, Debra Oberlin" and got this response:
"This hippocritical bitch should be public beat to death or better yet,turned over to any 100 of the thousands whose lives she helped ruin with her holier than thou bullshit,and let them deal with her.It would be too much to ask for that the system will subject her to the full extent of the law. They will probably coddel her because of the income flow she helped create."
Mothers Against Drunk Driving "was originally formed by Candice Lightner, who later left the organization. In 2002 she said that MADD 'has become far more neo-prohibitionist than I had ever wanted or envisioned ... I didn't start MADD to deal with alcohol. I started MADD to deal with the issue of drunk driving.'" MADD, like AA, the "recovery" system, and IDIP providers here in New Hampshire like Amethyst Foundation, Inc., Serenity House, Inc., REAP, Inc., don't want to eliminate drinking and driving--they want to eliminate drinking entirely in keeping with the religious/cult doctrines of AA (while making quite a nice, tax-free, profit doing so).
Good job, AA! You took an organization that once had merit (MADD) and ran it into the ground, trampling people's civil liberties, creating a legion of people that absolutely despise you.
The Heresy of the Twelve Steps
The fundamentalist, former drunks who run AA (and the entire "industry" including Amethyst Foundation, Inc.), if they had functioning intellects, would quickly realize that the Twelve Steps are heresy. But, either by choice, or by past alcohol use, or genetics, or a combination thereof, they don't. I'll spell it out for them:
"I am the LORD your God: you shall not have strange Gods before me." 1st Commandment
In the Alcoholics Anonymous program, you can use anything for your "God" or "Higher Power". A.A. has lots of stories of people using a bedpan, a teacup, a doorknob, a stone, a teddy bear, a mountain, a motorcycle, or "Good Orderly Direction" for their "Higher Power". You can pray to any Golden Calf, stone idol, or Higher-Powered item of Household Hardware that you like. One of the more ridiculous word redefinitions that A.A. offers us is, you can make the word "G.O.D." mean "Group Of Drunks". The LADC I was mandated to see told me, therefore, that my atheism was no excuse not to like A.A.
A.A. founder Bill Wilson ("Bill W.") wrote:
"I must quickly assure you that A.A.'s tread innumerable paths in their quest for faith. ... You can, if you wish, make A.A. itself your 'higher power.' Here's a very large group who have solved their alcohol problem. In this respect they are certainly a power greater than you, who have not even come close to a solution. Surely you can have faith in them. Even this minimum of faith will be enough."
--Twelve Steps and Twelve Traditions, William G. Wilson, page 27.
Given that most Christians believe in the holy trinity (The Father, The Son, and The Holy Ghost), I don't think many of them would think kindly to praying to a Group Of Drunks, or seeking and doing the will of a bunch of drunkards. Also, how would Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, or Jews feel about being told this?
But then, that's assuming that people that go to A.A. think. They don't.
In addition, the Twelve Steps talk about "God as we understood Him". Members are allegedly free to define God however they imagine or understand "Him" to be. Bill Wilson told A.A. recruiters to
Stress the spiritual feature freely. If the man be agnostic or atheist, make it emphatic that he does not have to agree with your conception of God. He can choose any conception he likes, provided it makes sense to him. The main thing is that he be willing to believe in a Power greater than himself and that he live by spiritual principles.
--The Big Book, William G. Wilson, Chapter 7, Working With Others, page 93.
Obviously, this makes A.A. incompatible with atheism. Atheism is the non-belief in a higher power. But A.A. members just see an atheist's nonbelief as another fault (like his alcoholism in denial) that needs to be cured. God will cure the poor sap's atheism--he just needs to be dragged in to A.A. meetings.
How about making my higher power Satan? Or Hitler? Or Wotan, Thor, Loki, etc...? Some of the people I've meet at A.A. meetings are absolutely insane. They have truly drunk the cool-aid and are full-blown cult followers. I'm sure some of the things they understand god to be would get them committed if anyone looked at A.A. with any degree of scrutiny. (A.A., for some reason, likely ignorance, gets largely a free pass by society, despite it being a religious cult which is completely ineffective at treating alcoholism.)
Bill Wilson emphatically repeated that doctrine in the Big Book:
Despite the living example of my friend [a sober Ebby Thacher] there remained in me the vestiges of my old prejudice. The word God still aroused a certain antipathy. When the thought was expressed that there might be a God personal to me this feeling was intensified. I didn't like the idea. ..
My friend suggested what then seemed a novel idea. He said,"Why don't you choose your own conception of God?"
That statement hit me hard. It melted the icy intellectual mountain in whose shadow I had lived and shivered many years. I stood in the sunlight at last.
It was only a matter of being willing to believe in a Power greater than myself. Nothing more was required of me to make my beginning. I saw that growth could start from that point. Upon a foundation of complete willingness I might build what I saw in my friend. Would I have it? Of course I would!
Thus was I convinced that God is concerned with us humans when we want Him enough. At long last I saw, I felt, I believed. Scales of pride and prejudice fell from my eyes. A new world came into view.
--Big Book, 3rd Edition, William G. Wilson, Chapter 1, "Bill's Story", Page 12.
We were now at Step Three. Many of us said to our Maker, as we understood Him: "God, I offer myself to Thee — to build with me and to do with me as Thou wilt. Relieve me of the bondage of self, that I may better do Thy will. Take away my difficulties, that victory over them may bear witness to those I would help of Thy Power, Thy Love, and Thy Way of life. May I do Thy will always!" We thought well before taking this step making sure we were ready; that we could at last abandon ourselves utterly to Him.
--A.A. Big Book, 3rd Edition, William G. Wilson, page 63.
Follow the dictates of a Higher Power and you will presently live in a new and wonderful world, no matter what your present circumstance.
--The Big Book, 3rd Edition, William G. Wilson, page 100.
You might be thinking that this is just "The Big Book" and A.A. doesn't really follow it strictly. You would be wrong in thinking so. You will very quickly learn that "The Big Book" is the absolute final authority and is never to be questioned! Bill W. is viewed as a near-God by these people. This, despite his well-documented abuse of his wife, infidelity, narcissism, and his utter failure at being sober (he cried out for whiskey on his deathbed).
The blind, cult-like obedience to the religion of A.A. extends beyond the meetings in church basements. In New Hampshire, the agencies entrusted with carrying out court-ordered Impaired Driver Intervention Programs (IDIPs), such as Amethyst Foundation, Inc., REAP, Inc., and Serenity House, Inc., are owned, operated, and staffed by A.A. members. Staff members spread the gospel of A.A. during IDIP classes, declare everyone an alcoholic (either admitted or in denial) and order mandatory A.A. attendance as part of the aftercare that virtually everyone is assigned. Also, as part of the "aftercare" is mandatory counseling sessions with Licensed Drug and Alcohol Counselors, who happen to espouse...yes, that's right, the tenets of A.A.
In essence, the state of New Hampshire let A.A. infiltrate a significant component of the government. (And I haven't even mentioned A.A.'s role in New Hampshire's prisons, parole hearings, professional disciplinary proceedings, and others yet...I will later.) The entire recovery industry is reaping in huge (tax free) revenue while indoctrinating new member into their A.A. cult. It's a great scam, and I'm sure the smart ones at the top are laughing their way to the bank. The stupid ones being exploited merely think they are saving souls.
Here's one final secret about A.A. members: they lie. They lie because they believe they are saving souls and that they know better than you. I've caught people at A.A. meetings (and at Amethyst Foundation, Inc.) red-handed in the act of lying, with well-documented evidence, and they still shamelessly maintain they are right.
If you are at the mercy of these people and need your license back, you need to understand the personalities you are dealing with. These are people who think they are fault-less and perfect because god has revealed to them the truth. They take pity on you. With the power they have been entrusted by the state they will bend you to their will. Play dumb. Reveal no will, backbone, or free-thought. Lie, as they will lie to you. Escape their clutches, get your license back and flip them the bird in your rear view mirror as you drive away.
If there were a god, and the Ten Commandments, these people would surely be going to hell.
Atheism: Ready for Primetime!
It's great to see an admired, lead character in a popular prime time television program trash religion. This makes me optimistic about the future of society.
Forced Worship Celebrates 3000 hits
Though it doesn't sound like very much, three thousand hits is actually a fairly impressive number for a little blog like this.
Good luck to those of you who are going through what I had to go through.
Would you like your story heard? Send it to me!
Good luck to those of you who are going through what I had to go through.
Would you like your story heard? Send it to me!
16 Red Flag Hearings: 14 Affirmed, 0 Reversed, 2 Remanded
Looking for Justice by holding a Red-Flag Hearing? Don't Count On It
The Department of Safety, Bureau of Hearings, has posted a Compendium of Superior Court Cases. Under "I. Substance Abuse Completion Requirements" there are listed sixteen red-flag hearings, or appeals of decisions made by Amethyst Foundation, REAP, or other administrators of IDIP programs. Of those sixteen hearings, none were reversed.
"90 meetings in 90 days"
Keskula v. Beecher, 04-E-142, (Merrimack, Lewis, 07/19/04) AFFIRMED
Referred to further counseling by LADAC; Petitioned for, and after a hearing, Hearings Examiner entered as his disposition the indefinite suspension of Petitioner's driving privileges and further directed that he attend 90 self-held group meetings in 90 days, and securing a low-risk alcohol evaluation from a LADAC …; Petitioner disagreed; appeal filed; HELD: "The Hearings Examiner acted within his discretion in making the rulings and determinations … There is ample support for the conclusion that the required aftercare was warranted in this case."
Charming. Ninety meetings in ninety days is an old AA slogan. It is how new people ("pigeons" in AA slang) are recruited. Like other cults, AA tries to insulate new member from the outside world during the period of indoctrination. There's no evidence that this helps in maintaining sobriety at all.
Issues of effectiveness aside, ordering AA attendance, which this clearly is doing, is unconstitutional.
All of these courts have ruled that Alcoholics Anonymous is a religion or engages in religious activities:
- the Federal 7th Circuit Court in Wisconsin, 1984.
- the Federal District Court for Southern New York, 1994.
- the New York Court of Appeals, 1996.
- the New York State Supreme Court, 1996.
- the U.S. Supreme Court, 1997.
- the Tennessee State Supreme Court.
- the Federal 2nd Circuit Court of Appeals in New York, 1996.
- the U.S. Court of Appeals for the Seventh Circuit.
- the U.S. Court of Appeals, Seventh District, 1996.
- the Federal Appeals Court in Chicago, 1996.
- the 9th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, September 7, 2007.
- the 8th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, 2006.
- the 3rd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, 2005.
- the U.S. District Court for the District of New Hampshire, 2006.
The United States Supreme Court has refused to hear challenges to those rulings, or to change or over-turn those lower court decisions. By letting them stand, the Supreme Court has made them the law of the land.
In the case of Grandberg v. Ashland County, a 1984 Federal 7th Circuit Court ruling concerning judicially-mandated A.A. attendance, the court said:
Alcoholics Anonymous materials and the testimony of the witness established beyond a doubt that religious activities, as defined in constitutional law, were a part of the treatment program. The distinction between religion and spirituality is meaningless, and serves merely to confuse the issue.
— Wisconsin's District Judge John Shabaz
"Conflicting LADACs"
Reyno v. Beecher, 05-E-603,(Merrimack, Fitzgerald, 01/18/06) AFFIRMED
Referred to further counseling by LADAC; suspension sustained after hearing with conflicting testimony from more than one LADAC. Program disagreed with LADAC. Hearings Examiner held that Petitioner must follow program's recommendation. Court affirmed in a short one-line opinion.
Bastille v. Beecher, 05-E-055,(Rockingham, McHugh, 04/27/05) AFFIRMED
Referred to further counseling, suspension was sustained after hearing with conflicting LDACs. Director ordered counseling. Court ordered Petitioner to submit to a new LDAC evaluation. Evidence was sufficient to sustain order, but time was up and court ordered restoration after it reviewed additional submissions by petitioner about two weeks later.
The bottom line appears to be: In a contest of opinion between an Amethyst Foundation/REAP/Serenity House LADC vs. your outside expert, you lose.
"The Court may not 'Second Guess' the Examiner's reliance on the Reports, as to what weight and credibility to assign them."
Gregoire v. Beecher, 04-E-0063, (Strafford, Smukler, 07/07/04) AFFIRMED
Referred to further counseling; did not comply and at a hearing, the Hearings Examiner ordered Petitioner to show compliance; Petitioner argues that although the examiner was correct in reaching the foregoing conclusions based on the evidence before him, the evidence upon which he relied was inaccurate. HELD: Petitioner has not met his burden of demonstrating that the examiner's decision was unreasonable or unlawful. "The Court … may not second-guess the examiner's reliance on the reports or his determination, as to what weight and credibility to assign them."
Oeser v. Beecher, 02-E-50, (Cheshire, Groff, 8/19/02) AFFIRMED
After a hearing ordering aftercare, Petitioner appealed raising "the following five issues on appeal: (1) …sentence has been served and her license must be restored; (2) … was not granted a hearing; (3) … license must be reinstated after 1-year; (4) hearing violated … right to due process and the DOS regulations; (5) … counselor is unqualified and the tests used … to determine her risk of re-offending were unreliable." Court held: "clearly the statute provides for continued revocation of the license of a person convicted of a DWI offense beyond the 1-yr period, if the person fails to meet the further counseling requirements. The Court finds that there is no evidence the hearings officer failed to follow the departmental regulations in the conduct of the hearing, or failed to give … a full and fair hearing in complete accord with all constitutional requirements of due process. Finally, the Court finds that … has failed to establish as a matter of law that the counselor was unqualified or that the tests were unreliable. The Court finds that the hearings officer's acceptance of the counselor's opinions and recommendations for treatment were reasonable."
Ferris v. Beecher, 01-E-42, (Strafford, Mohl, 4/6/01) AFFIRMED
Referred to further counseling by CADAC; after hearing the Hearings Examiner agreed with the CADAC and concluded that petitioner's alcohol abuse problem was not under control and that he was at risk to be a repeat DWI offender; appeal filed; petitioner considers himself only a "problem drinker" and argues that his test scores were inaccurate because he answered the questions based on his life style habits in 1998 as opposed to the present, as directed to do by the CADAC. The Court held: once petitioner demonstrates compliance with the program and is not at risk to recidivate, he can then petition to be decertified as an Habitual Offender.
So not only will your expert witness be wrong, the court will too, and it must defer to the wisdom of the Amethyst Foundation/REAP/Serenity House LADC! Nevermind that to be a LADC requires only a rudimentary training, and not even a high school diploma, which is driven by christian fundamentalist ideology that is unconcerned with issues such as fairness. Retribution, punishment, and "saving you" for your own good is all that they are concerned with.
I Don't Care If People Don't Like Me
Senator Franken got it almost right with his character, Stuart Smalley. But Stuart is kind and assumes the best in people (just not himself). The twelve-steppers of AA, founded on Christian born again fundamentalism, aren't They are full of fear, intolerance, and hate. The audience of SNL wasn't (and probably still isn't) ready for this type of honest depiction, however. It's still taboo to criticize religion. Hopefully people will start to see these psychotics for the irrational, dangerous, lunatics they are.
Naturally Incapable of Rigorous Honesty and Suffering From Grave Emotional and Mental Disorders
Every AA meeting opens up with this prayer:
If you have any independent thought, you will soon grow extremely tired of its astounding degree of condescension, blaming, arrogance, and shockingly blatant effort at manipulation.Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program, usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves. There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way. There are naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty. Their chances are less than average. There are those, too, who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders, but many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest.
"Rarely have they seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path"
Wow. It sounds like AA is very effective! This is a lie. Even AA admits it. They qualify this statement by "thoroughly." If it doesn't work for you, it's your fault--you didn't follow their (simple) path thoroughly enough. It's your fault! You can't even follow a simple program!!
The truth is that people who quit on their own have an equal, if not higher, success rate than those that follow AA's path. The problem isn't with the person, it's with the program. AA simultaneously falsely legitimizes itself as effective when it is not, and then bashes the poor alcoholic when AA doesn't work for him/her. Charming.
"Men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves. There are such unfortunates."
This is perhaps the most condescending statement I've heard anyone utter. The idea that a group of deluded, unthinking, unquestioning sheep could know myself better than I do is outrageous. They can't even accurately assess their own lives or critically assess the AA program. They unquestioningly accept what Bill W. says as the truth. If they are unable to question themselves critically, they are in no position to do so to me. But they do, and take pity on me as a hopeless case...an "unfortunate" who they turn their backs on.
People who fail are either:
"naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty"
I always snorted when someone said this. If AA members lived in a manner demanding rigorous honesty they would realize:
- that AA has been repeatedly shown, using rigorous double-blind, placebo-controlled trials, to be utterly ineffective in achieving sobriety. The likelihood of success is just as high in those that stop drinking on their own. One major study showed that people who attend AA are 9-times more likely to binge drink, compared with those who do Rational Emotive Behavioral Therapy (REBT). Even AA's triennial survey admitted to the ineffectiveness of its program. But AA members reject these pieces of evidence. They are in a constant state of denial, which is ironic because that's how they dismiss others (like myself) who disagree with them.
- that the evidence for a Christian God, which is what AA is based on, is nonexistent. Combine this with the many suspect, self serving reasons to believe in such a god (fear of death, fear of others unlike us, fear of change, selfloathing, etc...), and all this god talk begins to sound like a type of psychosis. I heard many testimonies about personal visits and conversations from God by people in AA meetings. I was scared that such delusional people were, not just walking the streets, but approved of by society.
- they are, in no way, superior to me in being capable of being honest with myself. Not only am I incapable of being rigorously honest, but I'm naturally incapable of even grasping it! I was evidently born defective mentally, and cannot operate at the high plane of mental functioning that average AA members are able. And even more, I'm so stunted intellectually and/or morally that I'm incapable of realizing it!
- they were wasting half their lives at AA meetings in dark damp church basements where all anyone ever talks about is how great the program is, how close to death they were, and how they would be dead if it weren't for AA. Say it enough times, and people will believe it, maybe, is what they are shooting for. This is also called "brainwashing." Look into it.
"suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders"
I guess my doctors are all incompetent. I must be bipolar or schizophrenic and they missed it. Maybe I should trust AA instead of them, especially since they're so rigorously honest, unlike my physicians.
"many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest."
So all you have to do to succeed at AA is have the capability of being honest. I guess "honest" really in the language that AA uses means "gullible." It certainly doesn't mean believing the truth. It means believing the lies that AA tells you, and then spouting off constantly about how wonderfully it works.
This mean-spirited, "kick 'em when their down," attitude is common to christian fundamentalists. It's not the version of Christianity taught in the older, more traditional forms of Catholicism, Protestantism, or other religions. The christian "born again" fundamentalists are a sick, twisted, selfish, and hateful lot.
I don't know which is more shocking to me: that society has such a beneficent view of the AA, or that people in AA can be such gullible idiots. Society doesn't really know that much about AA. Most people only know of someone who has gone to meetings. If they had gone themselves, or have read the lunatic rantings of Bill W. in the "Big Book" that is read like scripture in every meeting and followed with blind obedience, I'm sure they would think differently.
The sad fact of the matter is that there are many people truly helpless at the hands of alcohol. They are decent people who, for some reason, cannot stop drinking. They are suckered into the scam that AA will save them, if only they are subservient enough and give up all critical reasoning ability. Why trust medical researchers and physicians, when you can trust a former drunk's uncritical, uneducated religious rantings in the basement of a church? The fact that AA preys on these, the real "unfortunates," is the worst aspect of this entire sham.
Atheists Aren't The Ones Who Are Arrogant
During my IDIP courses at Amethyst Foundation, Inc., the LADC who was "teaching" told me repeatedly that my "arrogant atheism" prevented me from ever being able to deal with my "drinking problem."
I encountered this same insanity during the AA meetings I was forced to attend (especially when I refused to hold hands in a circle and pray with those losers).
You know what's arrogant? Thinking that the supreme being is interested in your sorry ass or your whining about your "drinking problem." That's the height of arrogance.
It's also the height of stupidity. But if you've been through this, you already know how stupid these people are. Willful ignorance is a prerequisite to being a LADC, and it's why they drank to deal with their problems before being certified to push their nonthinking ideology on others. I'd rather they had stayed the pathetic drunks they were.
Wanted: Civil Rights Attorney
I've been contacted by several people who, like me, are deeply offended by being forced by the state of New Hampshire to attend AA meetings that are religious, ineffective, and insulting to anyone with any degree of intelligence. We would love to file a class-action lawsuit in Federal Court on Establishment Clause grounds.
Are there any seasoned civil rights attorneys out there who would be willing to help? This abuse of power needs to be stopped. If so, please email me at AtheosAmericus@gmail.com
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